Towns not obligated to provide transportation

supergrover · Guru

Towns not obligated to provide transportation

Juanita · Guru

I think they should absolutely provide transportation to those kids.

Here's what I've NEVER understood...why are education and healthcare the FIRST things the government wants to cut funds from when the economy is bad? I dont' understand that theory. Those 2 things, in my opinion, are vital to us, and for years that's what they try and cut first.

3s_a_crowd · Guru

Wow interesting. Is there absolutely no other hs. closer? If there is I would think transportation would be covered for that one and not this one so if thats the case I can definitely see that if these students just chose the one farther away.

. There are online public high schools these days. Can the town use that to say the kids have a high school available if they pay for a computer and wifi access. If so I wonder if they would head that route if the parents werent willing to do transportation themselves

supergrover · Guru

3s_a_crowd wrote:
Wow interesting. Is there absolutely no other hs. closer? If there is I would think transportation would be covered for that one and not this one so if thats the case I can definitely see that if these students just chose the one farther away.

. There are online public high schools these days. Can the town use that to say the kids have a high school available if they pay for a computer and wifi access. If so I wonder if they would head that route if the parents werent willing to do transportation themselves

There is a town technically closer (on a map), but the kids would have to cross into Canada and cross back overto get to the town, and the time works out the same. Given the two options, they send them to the slightly further but better high school.

Travis and I were thinking what you are. We think rural education will increasing become a gathering of local kids with a volunteer/ed tech at the library or town hall with the kids doing online/virtual/skype-video education.

Actually, if we want to be all futuristic, we think even some more populated areas may move in this direction to cut down on brick and mortar school costs. Just our opinion.

Alison · Guru

supergrover wrote:

Travis and I were thinking what you are. We think rural education will increasing become a gathering of local kids with a volunteer/ed tech at the library or town hall with the kids doing online/virtual/skype-video education.

I agree - that sounds like a much better option. In fact, if I was in that situtation, I wouldn't want my kids traveling 188 miles a day for school. It's just not safe, especially in Maine's harsh winters.

And I agree with Ifer - we spent trillions of dollars on endless wars, and our education system is in the shitter.

apies · Guru

this has been something i've thought about a lot the past few years.

our school district, an award-winning district, provides bussing for those students who are outside of walking distance (VERY few in our community due to close-together homes and MANY schools) or across a busy road, but parents must pay 50c per ride for the students.

even though i am very pro-education, i am in-favor of parents contributing to the cost of transportation.

i don't know why it was ever determined that it is the schools' responsibility to get the kids to the schools. busses in our district cost 10s of millions of dollars every year. 50c per ride times twice per day times 180 days = $180. broken out over 10 months = $18 per month. manageable for almost every family.

i would LOVE to see this implemented in other school districts so that these transportation funds can go back into the schools. families who qualify for free/reduced lunch can apply for a waiver of transportation fees and ride free.

if i didn't already have a full-time job, i swear i'd start lobbying to put this in place nationwide. schools need the money for books, supplies, teacher salaries, professional development. parents can stop acting like the schools OWE them something and start contributing to the cost of transportation.

i got off on a tangent - but my point is, i think the school should continue to provide transportation, but the parents should have to contribute to the cost.

this probably doesn't sound very liberal/democratic of me (i'm registered independent), but i think people CHOOSE where to live. they need to accept the responsibilities of what comes with that and eat some of the cost.

CoffeeQueen · Guru

apies wrote:
this has been something i've thought about a lot the past few years.

our school district, an award-winning district, provides bussing for those students who are outside of walking distance (VERY few in our community due to close-together homes and MANY schools) or across a busy road, but parents must pay 50c per ride for the students.

even though i am very pro-education, i am in-favor of parents contributing to the cost of transportation.

i don't know why it was ever determined that it is the schools' responsibility to get the kids to the schools. busses in our district cost 10s of millions of dollars every year. 50c per ride times twice per day times 180 days = $180. broken out over 10 months = $18 per month. manageable for almost every family.

i would LOVE to see this implemented in other school districts so that these transportation funds can go back into the schools. families who qualify for free/reduced lunch can apply for a waiver of transportation fees and ride free.

if i didn't already have a full-time job, i swear i'd start lobbying to put this in place nationwide. schools need the money for books, supplies, teacher salaries, professional development. parents can stop acting like the schools OWE them something and start contributing to the cost of transportation.

i got off on a tangent - but my point is, i think the school should continue to provide transportation, but the parents should have to contribute to the cost.

this probably doesn't sound very liberal/democratic of me (i'm registered independent), but i think people CHOOSE where to live. they need to accept the responsibilities of what comes with that and eat some of the cost.

This is actually exactly what I was thinking. I think as a parent you need to select an area that fits for your family in terms of education, community, etc. If you opt to live in rural area. Then you cannot expect the schools to pay to transport your child 188 miles a day. It is kind of insane to me. It is a choice and in making that choices there will be pros and cons.

I kind of feel like parents today expect everything from schools and are doing less and less on their end.

I cannot imagine how it is even remotely cost effective to transport 7-12 kids. The cost of gas alone. So, I think the parents should pool together and come up with a way to all take turnes driving, etc. I mean sacrafices have to be made on all ends. We pay it out of our pocket somewhere.

3s_a_crowd · Guru

just for clarification the artical says 94 miles round trip.

supergrover · Guru

3s_a_crowd wrote:
just for clarification the artical says 94 miles round trip.

My bad Tracy, you are right.

But, 40 miles away or 90...there are a lot of kids here (I'm assuming everywhere) that are bussed 1+ hours each way. My bigger question was the stance of our dept of ed that schools need only pay the tuition, not a way there.

(I don't have a magic answer...obviously, neither do they. I do think if you choose to live in a rural community than you understand that there are sacrifices- I still think if I was on the school board I would offer tuition, or a room in town with computer and internet service for free where they could do virtual school.)

Juanita · Guru

April, I had honestly never thought of the parents contributing, but that's a really good idea.

Of course, then you'd have those families who can't even afford $18.00, so there would have to be some system implemented for them.

But I do like the idea of contributing to the cost of transportation.

3s_a_crowd · Guru

supergrover wrote:
3s_a_crowd wrote:
just for clarification the artical says 94 miles round trip.
My bad Tracy, you are right.
But, 40 miles away or 90...there are a lot of kids here (I'm assuming everywhere) that are bussed 1+ hours each way. My bigger question was the stance of our dept of ed that schools need only pay the tuition, not a way there.
(I don't have a magic answer...obviously, neither do they. I do think if you choose to live in a rural community than you understand that there are sacrifices- I still think if I was on the school board I would offer tuition, or a room in town with computer and internet service for free where they could do virtual school.)

I agree. I was just saying since melissa said she wouldnt want her kid going 188 miles a day for school. Not that 90 makes much difference but its all a game of telephone. Never comes out the same at the end.

CoffeeQueen · Guru

3s_a_crowd wrote:
supergrover wrote:
3s_a_crowd wrote:
just for clarification the artical says 94 miles round trip.
My bad Tracy, you are right.
But, 40 miles away or 90...there are a lot of kids here (I'm assuming everywhere) that are bussed 1+ hours each way. My bigger question was the stance of our dept of ed that schools need only pay the tuition, not a way there.
(I don't have a magic answer...obviously, neither do they. I do think if you choose to live in a rural community than you understand that there are sacrifices- I still think if I was on the school board I would offer tuition, or a room in town with computer and internet service for free where they could do virtual school.)
I agree. I was just saying since melissa said she wouldnt want her kid going 188 miles a day for school. Not that 90 makes much difference but its all a game of telephone. Never comes out the same at the end.

oops, took the miles from Alison's post. Regardless, the issue is transportation and should school districts be responsible?

bus cost is so expensive now. I mean just our cost to use bus for field trips, etc. is so high now. I do not think people think of that when they start talking school budgets.

Erin · Guru

Very well put April and I agree with the whole thing -even down to the registered independent ;)

I have been involved in special education cases where parents and attorneys are so wrapped up in what is "owed" to their child, they forget that there is a limited pool of resources. So, yes, every child should have accces to services , like transportation, but, should it come at the price of books, special ed teachers, art, p.e., etc? If something has to give, I would rather it be bussing than direct education services.

Juni · Guru

I agree with Apies whole heartedly and using the free and reduced pool for the transportation fees (not having to pay fees) would be a good way to do that. Honestly, transportation budgets are ENORMOUS so any way they can cut costs, they are going to try doing it there.

happylib · Guru

While I agree that there needs to be more parent responsibility and that children are not "owed" or entitled to everything under the sun, there is a problem here. Unless something has changed, parents are legally obligated to have their children attend school. I know when I was teaching, if a child was absent so many days from school, then there were consequences such as fines and investigations from child welfare. If the schools are saying to a parent you HAVE to send your child to school or else, then the schools become responsible for providing the transportation.

CoffeeQueen · Guru

Libby- in Michigan there is no law that public schools have to provide transportation. In fact the system I went to school in had no busing at all. They are required by law to provide transportation for disabled.

While you have to educate your child. There is no law that says one has to in a school system. You can pull them and home school.

Lizzy · Guru

i'm on the minority ;) I think schools should provide transportation as a basic service. Parents are paying property taxes which support the schools and it is the school who determines how those tax funds are spent - unfortunately or not. another point, as the article pointed out, is that school attendance is mandatory, but a way to get there is not provided, which creates a catch-22.

I guess I feel like everyone deserves it or no one does :mytwocents ;) Otherwise you are creating two classes of citizens (whether you think you are or not), eg. the girl whose parents cannot take her to school drops out, more often she will then become part of the welfare system. we, as a society, pay a much higher price than the cost of transportation at that point.

apies · Guru

lizzy, interesting ideas and to some extent i agree with where you're coming from.

my experience (from a former-educator's perspective) is that parents want these "necessities" but they aren't willing to pay for them. For example, think of how the price of gas has changed over the past 5 years. exponentially. yet for 5 years in a row, the raxpayers in the school district i used to work in voted down a tax increase (of 1c per whatever) to fund the schools. we cannot refuse tax increases AND keep up with the inflation that impacts the school districts.

my suggestion re: transportation costs was probably fueled by the fact that the parents at the school where i taught my last 2 years refused to raise their taxes. if they don't want taxes to increase, that money is going to have to come from somewhere else.

Lizzy · Guru

apies wrote:
lizzy, interesting ideas and to some extent i agree with where you're coming from.

my experience (from a former-educator's perspective) is that parents want these "necessities" but they aren't willing to pay for them. For example, think of how the price of gas has changed over the past 5 years. exponentially. yet for 5 years in a row, the raxpayers in the school district i used to work in voted down a tax increase (of 1c per whatever) to fund the schools. we cannot refuse tax increases AND keep up with the inflation that impacts the school districts.

my suggestion re: transportation costs was probably fueled by the fact that the parents at the school where i taught my last 2 years refused to raise their taxes. if they don't want taxes to increase, that money is going to have to come from somewhere else.

exactly. so crazy!!

Jennie · Guru

CoffeeQueen wrote:
apies wrote:
this has been something i've thought about a lot the past few years.

our school district, an award-winning district, provides bussing for those students who are outside of walking distance (VERY few in our community due to close-together homes and MANY schools) or across a busy road, but parents must pay 50c per ride for the students.

even though i am very pro-education, i am in-favor of parents contributing to the cost of transportation.

i don't know why it was ever determined that it is the schools' responsibility to get the kids to the schools. busses in our district cost 10s of millions of dollars every year. 50c per ride times twice per day times 180 days = $180. broken out over 10 months = $18 per month. manageable for almost every family.

i would LOVE to see this implemented in other school districts so that these transportation funds can go back into the schools. families who qualify for free/reduced lunch can apply for a waiver of transportation fees and ride free.

if i didn't already have a full-time job, i swear i'd start lobbying to put this in place nationwide. schools need the money for books, supplies, teacher salaries, professional development. parents can stop acting like the schools OWE them something and start contributing to the cost of transportation.

i got off on a tangent - but my point is, i think the school should continue to provide transportation, but the parents should have to contribute to the cost.

this probably doesn't sound very liberal/democratic of me (i'm registered independent), but i think people CHOOSE where to live. they need to accept the responsibilities of what comes with that and eat some of the cost.
This is actually exactly what I was thinking. I think as a parent you need to select an area that fits for your family in terms of education, community, etc. If you opt to live in rural area. Then you cannot expect the schools to pay to transport your child 188 miles a day. It is kind of insane to me. It is a choice and in making that choices there will be pros and cons.
I kind of feel like parents today expect everything from schools and are doing less and less on their end.
I cannot imagine how it is even remotely cost effective to transport 7-12 kids. The cost of gas alone. So, I think the parents should pool together and come up with a way to all take turnes driving, etc. I mean sacrafices have to be made on all ends. We pay it out of our pocket somewhere.

In the red- that isn't always a viable option, especially in very rural areas. Families can't just pick and move to a more urban setting in order to ease the transportation issue of getting their child(ren) to and from school. People live where they do not necessarily because of education but often times affordability. The homes in more rural settings are often less expensive than the houses in more urban settins where the real estate market is more aggressive. People want that urban setting for shopping, schools, etc. What about overcrowding?

For school field trips, the parents help pay for gas. Of course, we don't have a ton of newer buses, We still have older buses. I live three miles from Colin's school but trying to get him there and back eats up a lot of gas from our gas budget. We have biweekly income and every penny of that has a place to go with very little wiggle room. We are not able to sit there and accomodate another $18 or however much to get him to and from school. But we also aren't able to always drive him in either because of my school schedule, etc. Sure, there are carpool options but then you'd have a traffic issue on your hand as more and more parents chose to drive their children in. There are all kinds of issues and potential issues to look at before saying its the parents' responsibility to consider transportation.

Not every one is blessed with a substantial income. By enforcing some sort of situation where parents would have to pay could create a problem. Especially in families, like mine where there is only one income and it isn't the largest, where they'd feel pressured and shamed into giving the $18/mo for bus transportation. There are people like myself who would be in a very hard place where its either $18/mo, which we might not always have available, or cutting money from one budget (grocery) to be able to afford this expense. Its not all cut and dry. And this plan wouldn't take into account all people from all walks of life. And even people with larger household incomes would baulk at it, too..though they are better able to afford.

Sacrifices have to be made, yes. But we aren't always blessed with the option to choose where we live. Circumstances might mean living in a more rural area because its more affordable or that's where the job is.