for FIL

Tiffany · Senior Member

for FIL

supergrover · Guru

I don't hav insight, just prayers for your whole family :(

CoffeeQueen · Guru

is he on any treatment right now for lung cancer? what kind does he have? my FIL currently has stage 4 adenocarcenoma. He is doing chemo. It really varies with every person on how they deal at the end. Has he been in the hospital as of late? Is he on oxygen? If he was not too talkative before, then that alone is not much of a sign of days are near.

3s_a_crowd · Guru

i think it varies honestly, my grandmother wanted people around her when she died of lung cancer

Tiffany · Senior Member

Long story but I will sum it up as much as I can. He was diagnosed with rectal cancer several years ago...had surgery and did radiation/chemo for a short time. then from that point on it seemed he started getting more stuffs popping up. He was diagnosed with Lung cancer I think about 1-2 years ago.... well the dr gave him 6 months or less to live in June of this year he didnt tell us till after our wedding which was in August because he didnt want to put a damper on the wedding (he would have not but thats his thinking) so in between that and now we have been trying to be there for him and you know make it as comfortable as possible. he is currently "sick" like a cold but we know it's from the lung cancer.. He has issues with kidney, liver, adenoids, sleep apnea and emphysema. And keep in mind he has been smoking for about 50 years and curretnly still smokes about 2 packs per day, and is an alcoholic as well. Many times we thought he would be dead so long ago but he is still around but now he is literally dying because it has gotten into almost all of his organs... he has always been isolated in life in general (he has worked in the prison for 35 years so his life is pretty depressing) and was in the vietnman war, etc etc... he was very into hanging out and spending time after he told us he was dying and now hes completely cutting everyone off except for phone call he will pick up here and there but not in person. My SIL called this morning and he said he didnt know it was her at the door (when she was yelling that it was her and she had goodies for him, etc) he is just giving excuses. I know its all because of him nearing his death so we are trying not to take it personal but its hard at the same time because we want to make the death as comfortable as possible but he isnt allowing us to. We are going to just show up at his house tomorrow morning for breakfast whether he likes it or not. Its just crazy how suddenly things can take a turn for the worst in a second.

Juni · Guru

The only thought that I have is that maybe he doesn't want you guys to see him that way. If he is already kind of withdrawn, maybe it is just too uncomfortable for him to have people around. Sorry you are all dealing with that. :(

crystal · Guru

Oh wow, I'm so sorry. My grandfather died of lung cancer. I remember seeing him about a week before he died and he was unrecognizable. I'm wondering if your FIL just doesn't want to be remembered this way. He also had a hard time with a LOT of things that I think made him very embarassed. He was soiling himself, ect, and couldn't really get around by himself any more. I think when someone is used to being a "strong man", it is really humiliating for them to go through that all. I'm betting FIL is just embarassed and doesn't want his kids remembering him this way. Again, I am SO sorry. Sending lots of prayers...

happylib · Guru

I am so sorry. This is not easy. My step mother died of lung cancer about a year ago. I am guessing if he is moving around by himself he still has a little time. I was there for most of the last week my step mom was alive. She was not able to leave the bed and had difficulty talking. She was home up until the end. It was too much for my dad and she went to the hospital. By that time she was not really responsive although they say that she could probably hear us. The morphine and drugs they use for the pain keep them from responding. Her breathing was very labored and it was difficult to watch.

I think the others are right that he is probably having trouble dealing with it. Since his personality is rather introverted and he also drinks, he may just want to be alone. I don't know what arrangements you have, but it also occurred to me that because his body is not functioning, things have been happening and he doesn't want anyone in the house to see it. Is there someone that has a key that can go in there under the guise of bringing groceries or cleaning? How is he getting his meds? I hope there is a way that allows him to have his solitude while also being with his family.

Sending prayers for guidance, strength, peace, and comfort.

Lizzy · Guru

my mom died of lung cancer but up until the day before she suffered a stroke she was fine with people being around - in fact, she was often lonely so she craved company. after the stroke (I am not sure that is what it was, but it was something because she totally changed. one day she was fine, the next she was barely consious and from that day on, you could not really hold a conversation with her. she lived about 3 weeks after that. the hospice nurses were right on target too when they told us that. we were shocked - evne though we knew, it still came as a shock because it came on so suddenly. after that, she did not want alot of people over and would not interact with anyone.

i am praying for your fil. i hope he is comfortable. does he have hospice? what are they saying?

Tiffany · Senior Member

Thank you all for your inputs and pp&t's. Hospice tried to come last wed but he wouldnt let them in however James is going to his dad's in a little bit today so I should know more on how he actually looks and is functoning but he still doesnt sound very well. I should know more later today. Monday the kids (James and sister) are going to meet the hospice nurse and go over everything and what to do when he dies etc etc... hopefully we will have a better picture of how things are going after today and next week. I think it's a waiting game now because he is suddenly changing in so many ways. So sad indeed. We understand and respect him not to bug the crap out of him but the whole point is we want to make it as pain-free as possible and keep him at home as much as possible before having to go to hospice or whatever. He did say he didnt want to go to the hospital or anything because he is dying so he doesnt care for it. I can see where he can be embarrassed if his body is giving out near the end but we could care less about that just all about him passing as peaceful as possible. However, I know we cant change his thinking and that's probably expected to feel that way. =(

Juni · Guru

Tiffany wrote:
Thank you all for your inputs and pp&t's. Hospice tried to come last wed but he wouldnt let them in however James is going to his dad's in a little bit today so I should know more on how he actually looks and is functoning but he still doesnt sound very well. I should know more later today. Monday the kids (James and sister) are going to meet the hospice nurse and go over everything and what to do when he dies etc etc... hopefully we will have a better picture of how things are going after today and next week. I think it's a waiting game now because he is suddenly changing in so many ways. So sad indeed. We understand and respect him not to bug the crap out of him but the whole point is we want to make it as pain-free as possible and keep him at home as much as possible before having to go to hospice or whatever. He did say he didnt want to go to the hospital or anything because he is dying so he doesnt care for it. I can see where he can be embarrassed if his body is giving out near the end but we could care less about that just all about him passing as peaceful as possible. However, I know we cant change his thinking and that's probably expected to feel that way. =(

That is really tough. As far as I know hospice is done at home. I don't think they go anywhere - at least my grandmother didn't. Obviously if he isn't letting people in, that is a different story. Maybe that isn't the case everywhere though. I always thought the point of hospice was to die at home without intervention but with pain management.

Michele · Senior Member

I'm very sorry to hear this. You said that he has had multiple cancers over the years. I am only guessing here so take this as that - is there a chance the cancer may have spread to his brain? His change in behavior over the past few weeks could be a result of that. My MIL had pancreatic cancer and it spread to her brain at the end and she was very paranoid and difficult to deal with in her final days. Of course hospice knew to anticipate this and helped us through it. Perhaps you can ask hospice if it is possible in his case? There are meds he can take to help but he has to be willing to take them. My heart goes out to you guys. It is such a difficult road to be on in these final days. Keep us posted.

Tiffany · Senior Member

OK here is the update: Yesterday as in Saturday James and SIL went to dad's and he was acting so confused and kept repeating himself but they just helped clean a bit and take out the garbage, etc and after 40 minutes he basically kicked them out he was exhausted already when he had just woek up before they showed up. He has been sleeping a whole lot lately which is expected when nearing one's death. He just looked terrible and we think it's down to days to a few weeks now before he dies. Then today Sunday I went along with them and saw him. We noticed he looked a little better today he was able to shower etc that may have helped him look somewhat better but then we brought up the subject of what he wants to be done after he passes he got really agitated and pissy which we also expected... it's got to be hard to react to these type of things when you know you're dying and dont want to admit it. He still sounds bad looks bad as in losing weight but he's cleaner looking today after the shower. I have a feeling that is the phase he is in right now where his body is giving him the surge of energy before death. We are preparing for the worst to happen soon. I think so far we have been handling it well he has been sort of rude towards us but we all understand to not take it personal since he has so much emotion and he is totally confused.

Michele- yes he had rectal cancer then he got sick with something I cant remember and then had surgery and removed part of his lung the top part of the 3 part lung whichever side that one is on. He doesn't take care of himself at all as in smoking alot still, drinking alot, eats almost all processed foods etc. Also, yes we believe the cancer has already arrived to his brain he is forgetting alot he has forgotten his own kids once already and he is so confused about his medicines when we ask him if he has been taking it promptly...you get the idea... Basically our hearts are feeling very heavy right now. Trying to get through it all and go with the flow. He let us in yesterday and today so that was a great sign. He did say he is sorry he didnt mean to kick us out or anything but he is so tired and he is so confused he doesnt know anything anymore and he doesnt want to deal with it so therefore he goes to sleep or isolates himself. So sad. But thats how he wants to deal with it so we've got to respect that ya know??

happylib · Guru

Tiffany, have you been able to contact hospice and talk with them about the situation? It sounds like he is at the point that he needs someone there most of the time. From what you said, he is not managing his meds, which will only make the situation worse. I know that hospice was so helpful for us. They were really nice and friendly, but also pretty good about giving us space. They can also help you and your fil in deciding what he does and does not want as the time draws near and while they usually don't talk funeral arrangements, they can help sometimes generate the conversation. If your fil is taking his meds correctly, then it may help in deciding all of this.

Also, because he does not have enough oxygen, it can cause the confusion and the forgetfulness. We were told that the lack of oxygen causes dementia. I am guessing he is on an oxygen tank type of machine. Is he able to keep that thing operating on his own? Do you know if he is getting his breathing treatments? I seriously hope that all of you are able to get through to him. I am so sorry you are having to deal with this. Still praying.

Michele · Senior Member

happylib wrote:
Tiffany, have you been able to contact hospice and talk with them about the situation? It sounds like he is at the point that he needs someone there most of the time. From what you said, he is not managing his meds, which will only make the situation worse. I know that hospice was so helpful for us. They were really nice and friendly, but also pretty good about giving us space. They can also help you and your fil in deciding what he does and does not want as the time draws near and while they usually don't talk funeral arrangements, they can help sometimes generate the conversation. If your fil is taking his meds correctly, then it may help in deciding all of this.

Also, because he does not have enough oxygen, it can cause the confusion and the forgetfulness. We were told that the lack of oxygen causes dementia. I am guessing he is on an oxygen tank type of machine. Is he able to keep that thing operating on his own? Do you know if he is getting his breathing treatments? I seriously hope that all of you are able to get through to him. I am so sorry you are having to deal with this. Still praying.

Lib, she said he is still smoking a lot. Can he have an oxygen tank?? I agree hospice hopefully can give him one and monitor his use with it. Also, Tiffany although they cannot tell you specifically you can ask the hospice workers where you feel he is health/time wise. They are well trained and have seen the stages of decline. They were able to give us a specific timeline down to weeks and days in the end for my MIL so we knew what to expect.

Tiffany · Senior Member

We were able to meet with the hopsice yesterday. She basically gave us a idea of how things would look when he passes, etc because we have not dealt with dealing w one's death like we have had relatives pass but we weren't responsible for their funeral, assets, etc... this one is a bit different because its a parent and of course harder because hes alone and all and just two of his kids so it is relatively easier since they both are close so there wont be issues at the end. He does have PTSD ever since vietnam and went straight to work at the prison for over 30 years so his life has always been based on depression or alone. He never fixed it or worked on it he just wanted to stay that way. We will be going 2x a week and at least once on weekend and check on him. So it's really down to just waiting till he gets worse. Correct, he smokes like a chimney INSIDE his home so there is no way he can have a oxygen tank =( He struggles to breath alot. But he chose that path he doesnt want ANY treatment or any assistance if he gets worse he says. However meeting with the hopsice yesterday really helped us alot and not feel alone because hes such a difficult person. The nurse and social worker both said he is one of the hardest patients they have had to deal with.

FoxyRoxy · Guru

i don't have any advice i only wanted to say that i'm praying for all of you.

-- Edited by FoxyRoxy on Tuesday 18th of October 2011 12:23:54 PM

Tiffany · Senior Member

Thank you that means alot.

Alison · Guru

I'm so sorry you are going through this. :(

When my father was put in hospice, he passed away the next morning. It was like he didn't want to die at home.

mctex · Guru

I'm thinking of you, Tiffany, and keeping your FIL and all of your family in my prayers.