Hell yes - that is not me time. That is getting things for your family time. I would never count cleaning time as ME time.

honestly the past few days Ive been way better about getting things ton. Theres still tons more I could do in a day but dont.

One problem for me is I refresh momsquawk every 5 minutes even if no one is on. What a waste of time.

the past few days i dont let myself online until everyone has had breakfast and is done. so in the morning first thing i do is unload the dishwasher and start some laundry. then i get to check email etc..

when the kids eat lunch i prep what i can for dinner. and straighten the kitchen.

I also say I cant spend more than an hour online at once. I know that sounds horrible, but I would be online ALL day so I have to be realistic for myself.

Definitely!

That doesn't count as "me time." Me Time is an activity away from the house and kids that is something you ENJOY that relaxes you- not winds you up. So grocery shopping and cleaning are an automatic out.

It is perfectly reasonable to have him entertain the chitlins while you hustle about and tidy up or run to the store for a few things. Their his too! That's my line to DH all. the. time.

"Their you're kids too. Its time you spend a couple hours knowing what I feel like 12 hours a day..(muttered under my breath. "trapped in this damn house with these children and no car while you're off at work with grown ups talking grown up things while I'm wondering if I truly am sane.")"

muffy wrote:

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Here is my POV.

He has a job, say 40 hours a week.  that is not "free time" for him.

You have a job, that is taking care of the children and the household for those same 40 hours a week.  that is not "free time" for you.

while you are at "your job", you are responsible for getting your work done.  whatever is "manageable" during that time.  if the kids are away at school or whatever, that is time for shopping/errands/cleaning etc.  and lets face it, running a household usually isnt totally manageable in an 8 hour a day job - so there will be "overtime" that you both need to pick up on.

is it fair for you to do grocery shopping and cleaning in the "out of work" hours (ie those hours when you and DH are at your respective "jobs") - absolutely, if you legitimately did not have time during your "job".

certainly there will be days when you have to drive the kids around to whatever stuff, do some cleaning whatever for the house... and there is simply not enough time to grocery shop.  then by all means, that is "overtime" and not me time - meaning he watches the kids while you continue "working"

imo, what does not make it fair is you sat on the sofa on the internet eating chocolate bonbons for hours while the kids watch TV, then DH comes home and you decided that's the time to start cleaning.  (I am only using this as an example - not saying you do that :)  )

being a SAHM mom is NOT a 24/7 job.  But you do owe it it to the fairness of the relationship to make an effort to keep the kids/house under control, as what time "reasonably" permits, as your "job" during that time.

I am a SAHM and really try to do what I can monday to friday 8-6.  in return, i expect my DH to be fully engaged in the family environment in the evenings and weekends - he cooks, totally picks up after himself, does the kids homework, drives the around to their weekend activities etc.  evenings and weekends, we fairly and evenly split what has to be done.  (he even does the weekend grocery shopping, usually taking clara along, on saturday mornings).  we also get some "me time" - usually he will want to go for a bike ride for a few hours, i used to go running but now will take some time to sew or, as my pregnancy progresses, he lets me rest and read for about an hour on sat and sunday afternoons.

he will ask me "what did i do today"  and i can rattle off a list of stuff - just to let him understand/appreciate what i got done.

to me, the question is - how can you work on time management.  do you have a calendar of activities for all the kids?  do you keep "to do" lists of stuff for the home/family? i keep calendars and lists in the kitchen.  i write up a new list once a week, carrying over stuff from the prior week i didnt do, and DH can as well add to the list of he sees thinks of something to be done (he also does stuff on the list i designate for him to do as well :)  )

i know you have so much on your plate and are super stressed at the moment - but perhaps working on time management as you mention could be improved, could actually help your stress level and your mental well being overall?

 

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yeah see i only semi-agree with this, maybe bc my kids are still so little.
i cant vacuum when tehy're awake bc cara has a FIT.
i cant go to the supermarket with them easily at all - it can be done, but it's 1,000x harder with them, and takes twice as long.
i cant do any errands while R is at school bc C naps in the car and i'm stuck sitting in the driveway being totally "unproductive" (but i mean, i cant transfer her or else there's no nap all day - and i cant leave her alone out there).
i definitely need to do my errands on weekends, and i definitely dont think of this to be "me-time," and i dont see it as a time management issue either. 
it's just the circumstances right now.

 

Sara, everyone's situation is so different, even for SAHMs. Some people have more time because their kids are in school most of the time, some have kids who are at home the majority of the time. That makes a HUGE impact. It also impacts things like grocery shopping. I have to disagree with Megan a bit on this because I have "time" during the day to grocery shop, but I try not to because I HATE taking the kids. I try and go on M or W mornings when they are both in school, and if we HAVE to get a few things, I will take them, but it is too hard to shop with them, and so that is not something that always gets done for me during the day. I'm sure once my girls are in school (right now their school gives me 2 hours from drop off until pick up-enough time for the grocery store or some other minor things at home, but really not much time to accomplish anything), I will be able to get a lot more done. But since they are home the vast majority of the time and they nap, that just doesn't work for me.

I DO see being a mom as a 24/7 job. I also think that depends on the situation though too. I do pretty much everything here, in terms of keeping the house going and caring for the kids (Bill does home improvements)-I do all of the laundry, all of the cleaning, all of the cooking (with the exception of Saturday breakfasts most of the time), all of the shopping, etc. I can count on one hand the times Bill has gotten up with the kids on the weekends and let me sleep since Kate was born. Even when he is home, unless I am out of the house, I am in charge by default and by the way he parents the kids. Not that he is a bad father, but he is more permissive because he isn't here, he doesn't *want* to dole out the discipline, or he is just too tired. So I am always in charge. And even though my mom and dad watch them for me one day a week (that is where I get my me time), I am always on call. They don't need to call for much anymore, but they will if they need me. Not only that, even when they are resting, I am still the only one here, and emotionally, I never get a break when they are in my prescence. I don't get sick days (which became very clear when we all got the flu), I don't get vacation days-my job comes with me on vacation too. It is constant. Bill isn't even here from 7am until 6:30-7pm, so his time with them is extremely limited. Before this job, things were a bit more even, but this is where we are.

But I digress. I just wanted to offer my position on that. I do agree with Megan that Bill doesn't get me time while he is at work all day-it can be hard to remember that, but he is working too. However, we are both parents here, and we both have to pull our weight with the kids and the house. I expect that unless he has something else going on (I would never presume this kind of thing-we always communicate what we have going on) that if I need to run out for stuff in the evenings, that he can pick up the home stuff. he doesn't consider that me time for me, nor do I if he is going to Lowe's or something for home improvement supplies.

And I do often wait until Bill gets home to do chores. Not all, obviously, but there are things that are just hard to do with the girls running around. So when he gets home and we finish dinner, I will put away laundry, clean a bathroom, whatever. It makes my life so much easier to do that, and the girls like playing with him-my being out of the room at least forces him to actually play with them.

So this is how my week usually goes:
Monday-drop of the kids, grocery shop, get the groceries home and put away, go back to pick up the kids. Come home, make them lunch. While they eat, I usually make myself a salad, then prep dinner food. Then they rest, I eat lunch, spend time online or whatever, then I do a few quiet chores (our house is also such that I can't be upstairs when they are napping. I also can't do anything in the kitchen). The noise issue in this house keeps me from doing a lot of things during their naptime, but I can clean in the basement and I do laundry during naptime. They get up, I give them time with me for a while. If we can, we get outside, if not we play inside. Then I leave them to play on their own while I do a few chores and then start dinner. We eat, Bill comes home and joins us, I usually do dishes while Bill plays with the kids, or vice versa. By the time we are done, it is time to clean up the toys and go upstairs. We go up, pick out clothes for the next day, bath is every other night (we alternate), the get the girls to bed. When that is done, Bill picks out his clothes for the next day, takes a shower, I go downstairs, set his coffee, pack his lunch and pour the girls' milk into their sippies. Then I get a shower, and by then it is usually after 9pm.

Wednesday is the same except that I come home while the girls are at school and clean upstairs in their rooms or mine. Evenings are always the same unless I have something to do in the evenings, and then I go run out and do that before taking a shower.

Tuesday-my parents usually have the kids. I usually have appointments set for that day, and this is also my errand day-Target, getting gifts for upcoming parties, clothes shopping, BJs, whatever it is that we are in need of that week. Sometimes I am out the entire day with appts and errands. Other weeks I have very little to do, and then I come home and try and get to some of the things that haven't been done, like cleaning closets, seasonal type things (decorating, taking decorations down, switching seasonal clothes, raking leaves, whatever). I pick up the kids by 5pm

Thursday-the only difference here is that I try to take the girls out somewhere or do some sort of activity. Since it is the only morning during the work week that I have a free morning with them, I think it is important to plan something to do-even if we don't leave the house.

Friday-Anna goes to school and I have Kate. Sometimes we will go somewhere, sometimes we will come home. She is very content to play by herself most of the time, so I can often get a couple of small things accomplished before we pick Anna up.

Saturday/Sunday-Bill usually has a lot of things to try and get done because that is the only time he HAS for getting house stuff done. So I am in charge of the kids. If we can, we go outside and try to work together-like yardwork, gardening, etc-while the girls play on the swing set or ride their bikes on the sidewalk. I often sing at church, we have parties, etc. Not much gets done on the inside of the house during the weekends.  ETA-Bill also spends a lot of his weekend time at the farm because the vineyard and subsequent wine making takes a lot of time and effort.  His dad helps out with the spraying and such, but Bill and Matt are in charge of the other stuff, and Matt lives an hour away.  So he is there a lot.  Sometimes we all go over there, depends on what he is doing.

This is a freakin' book. Sorry!!! I am definitely not the best at time management, but I do have a routine. And I just can't get a ton done during the day. It is unfair to my kids, and too hard on me. I try to do my best, but my house comes second to my kids-they will be gone everyday before I know it, and I want to remember this time as a time I spent enjoying them-I don't want to remember how clean my house was. Plus my health issues compound things-I just can't do as much as I used to, and I have to be ok about that.



-- Edited by Supafly on Thursday 5th of November 2009 02:13:24 PM

I don't think it is unreasonable at all to expect to go to the grocery story without kids. Ray is only home about 5 days a month so I don't expect anything from him. I leave Raven with Stephen if I wanted some time by myself(store, library, etc.). I don't require that much me time though.

muffy wrote:

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Here is my POV.

He has a job, say 40 hours a week.  that is not "free time" for him.

You have a job, that is taking care of the children and the household for those same 40 hours a week.  that is not "free time" for you.

while you are at "your job", you are responsible for getting your work done.  whatever is "manageable" during that time.  if the kids are away at school or whatever, that is time for shopping/errands/cleaning etc.  and lets face it, running a household usually isnt totally manageable in an 8 hour a day job - so there will be "overtime" that you both need to pick up on.

is it fair for you to do grocery shopping and cleaning in the "out of work" hours (ie those hours when you and DH are at your respective "jobs") - absolutely, if you legitimately did not have time during your "job".

being a SAHM mom is NOT a 24/7 job.  But you do owe it it to the fairness of the relationship to make an effort to keep the kids/house under control, as what time "reasonably" permits, as your "job" during that time.

 

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I have to disagree on a couple of points:

Re: DH's job being 40 hours/week, and mine being the same...this isn't quite true.  My DH has a 20-30 minute commute.  So that tacks on about an hour that he's not working, but I am.  Plus the time it takes him to get ready for work in the morning, another hour where he's not working but I am.

He goes to lunch with co-workers or meets friends that work nearby.  Another hour that he's not working, but I am.  So that's already 3 hours out of the day, that while they aren't "free", and where he's not pursuing hobbies or whatever...he's not working.  But I am.  I don't have a commute, so I don't get that chill time in the car (which I hated until I didn't have it!).  I don't get to go out to lunch without being responsible for at least 1 other human being.  Hell, I can't remember the last time I went out to eat.

And as far as being a SAHM not being a 24/7 job...this is mostly true, after the infant phase.  For me ATM, it most definitely IS a 24/7 job.  John does a great job with the kids when he's home, and is a big help, but he hasn't figured out a way to lactate yet.  ;)  So the many middle-of-the-night feedings (and there are many!), he just can't do.  But I do know this is just a temporary situation.

 

IMO, if a SAHM isn't getting things like cleaning and grocery shopping done during the SAHM "business hours", LOL, because all of her other responsibilities precluded those activities, then the burden should fall on both parents to complete those tasks.  If my husband is working 40 hours/week, and I'm working 55 hours/week not including weekends, and I'm still legitimately not able to complete essential household chores, then absolutely I think my husband should help with those chores.

Alison wrote:

---

 

muffy wrote:

---

Here is my POV.

He has a job, say 40 hours a week.  that is not "free time" for him.

You have a job, that is taking care of the children and the household for those same 40 hours a week.  that is not "free time" for you.

while you are at "your job", you are responsible for getting your work done.  whatever is "manageable" during that time.  if the kids are away at school or whatever, that is time for shopping/errands/cleaning etc.  and lets face it, running a household usually isnt totally manageable in an 8 hour a day job - so there will be "overtime" that you both need to pick up on.

is it fair for you to do grocery shopping and cleaning in the "out of work" hours (ie those hours when you and DH are at your respective "jobs") - absolutely, if you legitimately did not have time during your "job".

being a SAHM mom is NOT a 24/7 job.  But you do owe it it to the fairness of the relationship to make an effort to keep the kids/house under control, as what time "reasonably" permits, as your "job" during that time.

 

---

I have to disagree on a couple of points:

Re: DH's job being 40 hours/week, and mine being the same...this isn't quite true.  My DH has a 20-30 minute commute.  So that tacks on about an hour that he's not working, but I am.  Plus the time it takes him to get ready for work in the morning, another hour where he's not working but I am.

He goes to lunch with co-workers or meets friends that work nearby.  Another hour that he's not working, but I am.  So that's already 3 hours out of the day, that while they aren't "free", and where he's not pursuing hobbies or whatever...he's not working.  But I am.  I don't have a commute, so I don't get that chill time in the car (which I hated until I didn't have it!).  I don't get to go out to lunch without being responsible for at least 1 other human being.  Hell, I can't remember the last time I went out to eat.

And as far as being a SAHM not being a 24/7 job...this is mostly true, after the infant phase.  For me ATM, it most definitely IS a 24/7 job.  John does a great job with the kids when he's home, and is a big help, but he hasn't figured out a way to lactate yet.  ;)  So the many middle-of-the-night feedings (and there are many!), he just can't do.  But I do know this is just a temporary situation.

 

IMO, if a SAHM isn't getting things like cleaning and grocery shopping done during the SAHM "business hours", LOL, because all of her other responsibilities precluded those activities, then the burden should fall on both parents to complete those tasks.  If my husband is working 40 hours/week, and I'm working 55 hours/week not including weekends, and I'm still legitimately not able to complete essential household chores, then absolutely I think my husband should help with those chores.

 

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ITA, but i think this is totally situational.  if you are truly busy all day and can't get it done, then it is fair to do it later and have dh watch the kids.  i agree with muffy though, because i have unmotivated moments where i will just not feel like doing anything and i do think that this isn't fair to my husband at all.  i've been trying to stay out of this funk because i have realized that the less i get done, the more of a funk i get in.  if i prioritize all my errands and accomplish them, i feel SO much better about myself. 

but, there is no way in hell i would take 3 kids to the grocery with me it just takes too long and is too stressful.  i think you should tell dh that you are trying this couponing thing and really want to save money for the family, but in order to do that you actually need to be able to take a little more time and concentrate while at the grocery store.  this is not "me" time.  this is time you need to help the family.

i am HORRIBLE at managing my time.  it drives my husband bonkers because he is extremely efficient at everything he does.  he hates wasting time.  the only way i can effectively manage my time is to have a routine.  if my routine gets messed up, i start sucking again, but dh has come to realize this.  he knows i don't mean to suck so, as long as i have my routine and nothing interrupts it, things go pretty smoothly.  i would recommend trying to create a weekly schedule for yourself.  make it realistic, and talk to dh about things that really stress you out when you try to do them with the kids there. 

my problem is that when i feel overwhelmed i just get so stressed and i stop doing anything.  i shut down.  so i have been working on stopping this habit because i feel so much better if i just organize my life and start trying to get my things done.  no more shutting down.

 

muffy wrote:

---

 

Alison wrote:

---

 

muffy wrote:

---

Here is my POV.

He has a job, say 40 hours a week.  that is not "free time" for him.

You have a job, that is taking care of the children and the household for those same 40 hours a week.  that is not "free time" for you.

while you are at "your job", you are responsible for getting your work done.  whatever is "manageable" during that time.  if the kids are away at school or whatever, that is time for shopping/errands/cleaning etc.  and lets face it, running a household usually isnt totally manageable in an 8 hour a day job - so there will be "overtime" that you both need to pick up on.

is it fair for you to do grocery shopping and cleaning in the "out of work" hours (ie those hours when you and DH are at your respective "jobs") - absolutely, if you legitimately did not have time during your "job".

being a SAHM mom is NOT a 24/7 job.  But you do owe it it to the fairness of the relationship to make an effort to keep the kids/house under control, as what time "reasonably" permits, as your "job" during that time.

 

---

I have to disagree on a couple of points:

Re: DH's job being 40 hours/week, and mine being the same...this isn't quite true.  My DH has a 20-30 minute commute.  So that tacks on about an hour that he's not working, but I am.  Plus the time it takes him to get ready for work in the morning, another hour where he's not working but I am.

He goes to lunch with co-workers or meets friends that work nearby.  Another hour that he's not working, but I am.  So that's already 3 hours out of the day, that while they aren't "free", and where he's not pursuing hobbies or whatever...he's not working.  But I am.  I don't have a commute, so I don't get that chill time in the car (which I hated until I didn't have it!).  I don't get to go out to lunch without being responsible for at least 1 other human being.  Hell, I can't remember the last time I went out to eat.

And as far as being a SAHM not being a 24/7 job...this is mostly true, after the infant phase.  For me ATM, it most definitely IS a 24/7 job.  John does a great job with the kids when he's home, and is a big help, but he hasn't figured out a way to lactate yet.  ;)  So the many middle-of-the-night feedings (and there are many!), he just can't do.  But I do know this is just a temporary situation.

 

IMO, if a SAHM isn't getting things like cleaning and grocery shopping done during the SAHM "business hours", LOL, because all of her other responsibilities precluded those activities, then the burden should fall on both parents to complete those tasks.  If my husband is working 40 hours/week, and I'm working 55 hours/week not including weekends, and I'm still legitimately not able to complete essential household chores, then absolutely I think my husband should help with those chores.

 

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let me clarify what i meant my being a SAHM "not" being a 24/7 job.

i mean that the time that DH is at work, that is absolutely 100% my "job".  but the time he is not at work, when his job is over, it is up to us as a couple to share the "parenting" AND household job 50/50.

of COURSE taking care of children is a 24/7 job - that is obvious.  but it is not one that a mother, being sahm or not, should shoulder the entire burden of 24/7.

i know there are some dipshit guys out there who don't do much and expect that since their wife does not earn an external paycheck they dont have to do jack shit to raise their kids or take care of their house - at anytime.  that to me is wrong.  (my portuguese housekeeper had suffered from that caveman mentality of her husbands for years - i was quite frustrated by his attitude)

so i guess my point, which might have not been clear at the outset, is to speak about equality of parenting and household - especially in the evenings and weekends. but also to mention that, imo, it is a sahm's obligation to get a "reasonable" amount of work done during the day when hubby is not there.  (but heck, chauffering 3 kids to activities everywhere all afternoon is probably 25-30 precent of my daily job - not productive at all and i hate it!)

it is true, i have been a sahm for only a year now.  and since i still seem to be on project management "autopilot" from my old career, i tend to manage being a sahm much as i used to manage work projects - project definition, (tho these days a project can be titled "christmas" or "monthly food planning" LOL), task definition, timeline, milestones, dependancies (can't cook and freeze food till the shopping is done!) completions... crazy, but it works for me.  but what i really like is that i get stuff done, and more importantly, i can SEE what i have accomplished.

to the breastfeeding example - we had a system worked out. i breastfed each of mine for 9-10 months, (and held down a 50-60 hour week job working in a professional career.- yes, a walking zombie)  I spent most of the nights with my boobs hanging out.  of course i was the only one who could do that.  to compensate, DH took "baby duty" from 8pm to 11pm, and from 5am onwards. he also let me sleep in both weekend mornings till 9-10am.  he would get up with the cries, change nappies, and bring baby to feed and take away when done.  that was a good help, and a nice way to share the difficulties of the demanding situation.  also, his saturday morning grocery shopping habit was born from this - he would take the baby, from the earliest infancy till today he still takes clara - and he does the grocery shopping with the kids while i got to sleep in on saturday mornings.

so, i agree with what you wrote at the end, and believe i stated that in my original post - that yes, absolutely, the household burden should be shared during evenings and weekends.  i think that was pretty much my entire point  :)

 

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ah ok - this makes more sense :) i didnt understand the 24/7 thing either but now i get it :)